Venus!
Say it's not so! You are moving back to London? I am very sorry to hear this :-(. I love picturing you on your beautiful island....

I know you well enough to know you had no intention of blaming the victim.
Its funny - when i first read your comment about getting in the cab with two men, I was taken aback - Now, thinking it over it makes perfect sense. Here in the states we ride in a cab with a bullet proof glass partition between us and the driver - his cab and drivers licencee must be displayed. The first time I ever remember sharing a cab was in Athens - it was all new to me. It never occurred to me that riding with two men could be dangerous. Being something that doesn't happen here, our Mothers never taught us that should be something to avoid. Now, I think about the countless times I got into route taxis in Jamaica never thinking about the passengers -never thinking about being a woman alone.
I was very lucky. Today, you taught me something new - something very sensible that I will be sure to pass on to my daughter and nieces when they travel.

Thank you for your vote of confidence RW Im chuffed.

Yes with heavyhearts we will leave our little Aegean Gem, but it is temporary. We will be back I wrote about it in another thread, which I will update and bump so as to fill you and BP in and not hog this thread.

Love, peace and nice things to all x x

Some perspective regarding travel:
1. The NYC (or any other major city) subway - how many years have we been hearing about crimes of all sorts, violent and otherwise, on the subway? When I lived in New York in the early 80's I'd work until 10:00pm and take the subway home after that. Brazen and young, what can I say - brazen young AND on a tight budget. These days when I go to New York you won't catch me on a train after 9:00pm. The expense in taking a cab from point A to point B is huge - but safety always first.
2. Speaking of New York - just comuting home on the Long Island Railroad some nut empties a gun into a train car as it pulls into the station, killing and maiming many people.
3. In Nigeria a World Bank employee was kidnapped, raped repeatedly and held for several days. Now the World Bank will not allow their employees on Mission to use any type of taxi cab - anywhere. They are all given "trusted" drivers. That said, I believe when my Mom was held up at gunpoint in Mozambique she was set up by one of these "trusted" drivers.
4. Don't even get me started on Israel or Mexico
5. In Tolouse a madman opened fire on a Yeshiva (orthodox religious Jewish school) and killed 5 or 6 - mostly children
6. I was watching an HBO doc on brain injuries - one of the patients, a college aged man, was in what they called a perpetual vegetative state. Why? When traveling in Amsterdam, he was walking at night, accosted and thrown off a bridge, left for dead.
7. In Honolulu, at a large conference reception at a well known hotel in Waikiki a young woman, daughter of one of the attendees at the conference, dissapeared, only to be found murdered and raped on the hotel's front lawn the next morning.
8.I googled "Crime in Disneyworld" - here's a few results:
a. "ORLANDO, Fla.— A man has been arrested on a sex-related charge at an Orlando water park, the fifth such incident in the area in a month.
David Eugene Thomas was being held without bond Friday at the Orange County Jail after he was charged with molesting a 13-year-old boy at Walt Disney World’s Typhoon Lagoon." http://www.topix.com/forum/city/orlando-fl/T5K5LB77FQ3E8J3GV
b."Two 20-year-olds from Connecticut were abducted while walking through the parking lot at Downtown Disney late Saturday night. Jessica Dellacamera and Justin Stetzer said they were going to their Disney hotel when a man called them to his car. For the next 15 minutes, they took the pair to two ATMs and ordered them to withdraw money. Deputies were going over banking records to see exactly where the pair were taken. The attackers then took the two to the Bass Road landfill in Osceola County. There, Dellacamera and Stetzer said they fought for their lives, because they thought they were going to be killed.
The attackers pistol-whipped Stetzer and the gun went off. That's when the three attackers finally fled, leaving the two at the landfill. They were not seriously injured." http://www.wftv.com/news/news/tourist-industry-concerned-after-disney-kidnapping/nFB6Y/
...finally and sadly, right in my own neighborhood a few years back - a couple was found murdered on the beach in Jenner CA. They were visitors to the area, we know that - but that's all we know. Their bodies were wrapped in a blanket and they were discovered on the beach in Jenner.

So...really bad things really happen really everywhere. Does this mean we try to find the "safest" place to go on vacation, at the risk of possibly "imprisoning" ourselves in an all-inclusive our within a tour group? Or do we just stay home? Personally - I choose to live my life which includes travel. I take precautions, I am not reckless and I am always in a state of mind where I can feel and trust my gut. How about you guys?

Also, criminals can be EXPERTS at deception and not always easily spotted through appearance or demeanor.

ITA! And the one's in Negril take this to a whole new level.

RG: "imprisonment" in a a/i? lol. It's not imprisonment it's lovely actually lol. Himself is a born and raised Jamaican. When we were on Catcha's property as guests I said....we should go out and do something we've never even left this property. HIS response was "out there is hell and in here is heaven why would we leave?". From his lips....

negril is a cesspool waiting to erupt at all times . . . let's face it, a good number of tourists come for the hard drugs . . . a person just has to go into the water by bar b barn and spend an hour paddling around and observing the lane that divides bar b bar and mom's . . . the tourist demand for the hard drugs is HUGE . . . where there are drugs there are problems . . .

^^^THAT^^^^

“Many can deal with things going wrong if they can count on justice to follow.”
I don’t know that having your 13 year old boy molested by some perv would count as “things going wrong”, but I do see your point in the general sense.

“Why is that not the case in JA, when and how did that start, or has it always been that way?”
Not sure when or why it “started” or if it was always the way – I know of a murder that happened close to 40 years ago that remains unsolved, as well as countless others following. I know they never caught or arrested or even identified the guys that home-invaded my friend’s house close to 6 years ago.

The police in Jamaica have always had the reputation of being corrupt and easily bought off. They’ve been known to murder for hire – or even for the hell of it (Mickey Hill, Sonnieko Williams). How do you change a mini-culture of corruption? Lord knows various times its been “tried” without success. Kingfisher? Joke. The JLP had crime stats down significantly – but police brutality and murder stats up significantly as well.

And here in the USA the justice you get is the justice you buy and varies based on the color of your skin and the size of your bank account.

“RG: "imprisonment" in a a/i? lol. It's not imprisonment it's lovely actually lol” Oh, sh*t…sorry! I was actually referring to another comment that mentioned imprisonment within one’s resort walls due to safety concerns. Sorry I wasn’t clear about that – not bashing the AI experience, many do enjoy that.

“i sure feel that hatred more in negril than the rest of the country” – I’m shaking my head Jitterbug and I do remember your “rasta” car bashing experience so I’m not saying its not there – but I never feel it. Never and haven’t ever. Knock effin’ wood.

“negril is a cesspool waiting to erupt at all times . . . let's face it, a good number of tourists come for the hard drugs . . . a person just has to go into the water by bar b barn and spend an hour paddling around and observing the lane that divides bar b bar and mom's . . . the tourist demand for the hard drugs is HUGE . . . where there are drugs there are problems . . .”
OK, look – there has been drugs – “hard” drugs, particularly cocaine – in Negril since the beginning of time. And there was a time when the brutality was completely out of hand, directed at locals and expats – asasinations, rapes, beatings….over drugs and over fence lines and just for a few dollars for heaven’s sake. Lets go back 20-30 years ago – Negril was the wild, wild west. It had been the jumping point for ganga smuggling to the US in the ‘70’s and it’s “outlaw” nature, that and the fact that it was not all that easy to get to – made it so. Still back then you could not get a cop to come out past the Lighthouse. For several years we actually had private security for our yard – when we arrived we were given a phone number and a code to punch in should the sh*t ever hit the fan – our instructions were to stay in the house and stay low because whatever private militia that was hired would come in guns blazing.

Comforting, huh? And why? Cause you couldn’t count on the cops doing that!

So – what’s so different now? Not much except there are far more people in Negril. The density has gotten such of course crime is going to increase. Negril doubles or triples its population between November and May. That’s a lot of opportunity for a lot of predators that can now easily come in and out of town on the improved infrastructure. There’s lot of new people in town – a lot of people in my ‘hood that we don’t know and that full time residents in that neighborhood do not know. This is why, in my lovely West End neighborhood two of us walk our neighbor home after a visit at night. Nobody walks alone.

Let me ask: Has there been any published articles about this incident? If so, can I see a link?

Medi....you should check out Cher's place in Duncan's. It's nothing like Negril. Not saying there is no crime there as there is everywhere but it's not the same vibe whatsoever. You'd have to walk to the sea but I think you'd love her apartment

RW ((((HUGS))))

First, to clarify, when I was giving my examples of the price differences between route taxi and private over a 2 week or longer stay, I was speaking in US dollars not JA.

Second, IMO the driver is JUST AS GUILTY as the passenger. The driver is the one who diverted from taking his fare to the West End and lied to his fare when she inquired why they were going the other direction. Just because he is not the one who did the actual robbery, he is just as guilty. Two guys go to a store to rob the place, one stays outside as the lookout while the other goes in and robs the place. Are they both not guilty? Absolutely. Or one stays in the car as the getaway driver. He's guilty too. Trying to say the driver is not guilty in this case is laughable to me.

I had not heard about the 'not getting into a Red Plate with two guys in it' until after I got back from my last trip. I consider myself lucky as I've never paid that much attention to this and will definitely be paying CLOSE attention in the future.

Another thing I really took away from the suggestions here is to get the license plate of every taxi you get it. However, I don't think just writing it down is that good because they could easily steal that piece of paper you wrote it. A better option might be to stand in front of the car and text the license plate to a friend. If the driver asks what you were doing, just say, "Oh my friend and I always text plate numbers to each other and where we're going, just for safety." That way if something should happen, someone else knows the taxi you were in. I plan on implementing this next trip.

Fatty, thanks for clarifying. I'm glad to hear that. It sounds as though she is starting to heal from her ordeal. I will continue to pray for her.

“one major difference is that i trip alone and you are partnered . . . so, it's like comparing apples and oranges . . . your "head shaking" is humours to me . . .”

Yes, I have my husband with me – but not always, lol! I move about alone quite a bit. So not quite apples and oranges – more like tangerines and oranges perhaps. Please don’t take my comments the wrong way – my head shaking was not in disgust or confusion even, just that you are not the only person to say this and I shake my head that you and so many get this vibe. It saddens me and makes me wonder – (not knowing of course how long you’ve been coming to Negril) but was it always that way for you? Did you always feel hostile vibes coming from certain locals?

I think another difference in our experiences it that I live and have lived for the past 10 years in the same neighborhood where it is pretty warm and fuzzy. When I walk West End Road I’m never bothered, quite the opposite – always nice good mornings etc. When I do venture downtown, I don’t get those vibes…maybe I do and I don’t notice or I ignore them. Its usually just to run errands so I’m in and out pretty quick. I don’t spend much time on the beach anymore and almost never “walk” the beach. So maybe its more about where I “hang”. I don’t know.

What happened with you and that Rasta sucked wind indeed and would be enough to sour me as well…so when you go next week I too hope the experience is different and you have a 100% fabulous time. Eat a mango for me!!!!

“1. Everyone does not need to know your bussiness. 2. Everyone does not need to know were you live, and of those who know, all should not be invited into your yard, and most definately not into your home. 3. Sit and listen, don't share, learn your surroundings and the people in it. 4. when you go out at night make sure you are in the company of people you trust. 5. When you move about or leave your yard for extended time, don't even inform your landlord of your moves.”

Standing O for DoctorO!!!! These five rules alone should be engraved into everyone’s brains.

“in fact it's hard to find adults who were actually raised in Negril”
Again, not hard for me, there are many in my neighborhood born and bred in Negril, families that go back for generations in the same yards. But I do agree in that Negril as a whole has a good deal of transplants. In that way it is very similar to Bodega – nuff “old families” still here but nuff of us transplated as well and love it as well as if were born and bred.

Rootswoman-a great big hug to you dear....

Jitters-going back again...Good for you...I know you will have a safe journey..hope things are coming along at your place..will you be out and about again or just hanging in da yard???

BTW-it was you Jitters, OHliz,Cher,Dr O,few other women that inspired me to finally go for it and rent -a-car-this June( I know, I've said i would do it before-but this time for sure) and Drive myself for the first time..Being way out in the country it makes more sense-and I love to get out on the road-less-traveled..